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well guys i look at it like this marty,holm,and ect. blow it when they tried to be GM'S and the head coach at the same time. those guys aren't good talent evals. they get power angry aka butch davis and do what they want no matter whats the best for the team. its time to hire a true GM not the one the head coach picks or the GM who picks the head coach.
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Did Holmgren give up his GM duties?
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Not at all. Frompeople I know who are tight with the organization - Bill Cowher was alotted 1 pick per year. 2nd round Alonzo Jackson - went out of the NFL real fast. 3rd round, Willie Ried - same fate. Those are 2 I know for sure. The other part I heard was that Cowher wanted JAckson in round 1 - the FO said screw that and traded up for Palamalu. Cowher canNOT pick talent. HE can coach unbelievably well and get his guys to run through a brick wall - but he's not GM material. GREAT COACH though. ------------------- Browns without Braylon Edwards, 1-0. Jets with Braylon Edwards, 0-1. coincidence? |
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Guys, I honestly think that Lerner is going to get rid of Mangini at the end of the year...I think that he is honestly buying time now, and will not fire a coach midway through the season! Unless EM goes atleast .500 the rest of the way, he is a lame duck! The GM won't be hired until Jan/Feb., and EM will be out of Cleveland...He is too much of a liability for the "business" side of the organization!
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I dont think he would ever come here. He knows the fans really do NOT like him. (I dont!) Too many of us remember his monotone press conferences, his "metcalf up the middle" and worst of all, getting Bernie fired. His poisonous relationship with the fans helped lead to The Move. I dont want him, I dont care what his record is. It would be like going back to an abusive spouse and hoping things would be better. ---- |
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Not sure who I would want, other than the obvious Marty/Chin combo but I do think whoever it is will be allowed to fire Mangini. I am sure Lerner is saying that Mangini's job is ok for now, but that doesn't mean he wont allow the new GM to do his dirty work.
Unless Mangini really turns it around by the end of the season, I think he is history. ---- |
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Yea everyone... Lets bring in Cowher. Thats a chin that I want to look at. Nothing like being reminded everyday of how he beat the BROWNS brain in Sunday after Sunday. He and Hines Ward would laugh their asses off at the Browns, saying "same ole Browns."
No thanks. Browns need to create their own damn history. I say no to Steeler Sloppy Seconds. |
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Any new GM and/or HC must adhere to the following:
Any new GM and/or HC stating his desire to come here will be taken out of the interview pool immediately. The reason being is, it defies common sense. To re-continue the app process you must submit a 1000+ word letter on the why's of your interest. You will then be placed into the following years GM and/or HC candidates as this years process was closed to you, remember? Hey, what's another year anyway? Dressing professionally for games and for that matter just plain dressing will no longer mandatory, but optional. If any player is to be fined for conduct detrimental, you may fine the leaugue minimum of $1,700ish dollars. However, if the player involved "INSISTS" it was a mistake, you will pay the fine. There's 2 reasons for this. #1, players walk on water, and #2, you don't. As a suggestion and in regards to preventing the bottled water fiasco of 2009, as the HC, please canvas any player that might need bottled water and if so, hand deliver a case to them. Worse case scenario is that there are 53 players wanting water. In that case, find 52 other helpers, or hold practices and/or functions at Dasani, Aquafina, or any other popular bottled water plant. Make sense? Any future trades will not be approved without "the expressed, written consent" of 100% of the members of these Cleveland Browns Chatroom Forums. Once submitted for review and voted on via the "nifty" polls we have, said trade scenarios will be accepted or denied within a reasonable amount of time and with 100% approval. In regards to the annual NFL Draft, you will no longer field a scouting team. Starting "NOW" for 2010's draft and continued yearly starting the day after the draft thru the beginning of the following years draft, you will assemble a team to monitor/chart/log all "suggestions for or against players,", all positive or negative comments about players, all "I Want or I don't want that player", all "We Should or We Shouldn't Take a Certain Player, all "Here's My Mock Draft" as well as any "Your Mock Draft Sucks, Mine's Better" comments, any "He's Injury Prone comments as well as any "No he isn't Injury Prone rebuttals, and any other references, big or small regarding anyone's (on these Forums/Boards) hopes, likes, dislikes, needs, want's, don't want's, desires, undesirables, etc, etc on who or who not to the Browns should take at what position, in what round. All positives and negatives on all players will then be combined together to generate an easily followed position by round draft selection process. NOTE: These will be saved for eternity and avail to John Q as needed for rebuttal on any "I said we shoulda taken him" or any "I wanted Him" -vs- any "You said we shouldn't take him" or any "I didn't want him" arguements in the next few years to decades from now (Peterson, Quinn, Courtney Brown, Big $$$ Warren, etc,etc) . Any stationary bicycle Shaun Rogers uses will now be motorized. For that matter, any weightlifting equipment will be motorized as well. Any positional changes (from starter to bench, etc) will be brought before a hand selected board of "5-7 Current NFL Head Coaches" for their approval or veto of said player move. The theory here is, if we can't beat-em we'll trick-em (by going the opposite of what they suggest). In regards to any player who shows the least bit of "homesickness" and/or when during their nightly counting of, "dollar by dollar" their current years total salary and bonus" they show signs of missing their mommy, they're mommies are to be brought in to wetnurse them thru training camp and/or until they acquire a girlfriend in 3 travel cities minimum. By no means do the 3-4 hometown girlfriends count in matter whatsoever in the final tally. Not fair to the players. MNFs Don Meredith on Fair Hooker: "I never met one". "Badges"? "Badges"? "We don't have to show you any stinking badges". |
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I could really like that. Oz was awesome for us back in the day...he also knows what it takes to win at this level. |
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He can fire Mangini, then you dont have to worry about him! |
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I believe Mark Brunell was drafted by Green Bay while he was Coach. Fifth round 93 draft. Had a pretty damned good run in Jacksonville. Not a bad QB. Holmgren does have and eye for QB talent. A fine quality in a front office executive. And I really like Mariucci as an underling candidate for Holmgren. I think he has a sound football mind and a real passion for the game. That's another good think about MH. He's been around a lot of good quality coaches in his career. A huge talent pool to surround himself with. Won't happen. Know why? We can't get that lucky man. We will pick up some "yes man" sycophant and maintain the status quo. EM will run it all right into the ground. That's the way it works here in Brownstown. -------------------------------------- Abandon hope, all ye who enter here. |
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There could be over 10 coaching vacancies next year, with Cleveland and Oakland being at the bottom of the list. Why would one of the top names : Cowher, Holmgren, Shannahan, Gruden, etc.. come here? Don't get your hopes up. Be realistic.
Possible HC openings in 2010 1. Washington 2. Oakland 3. Cleveland 4. Carolina 5. Jacksonville 6. Dallas 7. Tampa bay 8. St. Louis 9. San Diego 10.Tennesse 11.Buffalo When our team is in worse shape than most of the others, why would a big name come here? We may get a new Front Office and HC, but it will most likely be someone who is not a HC now. Some guys to look at: Leslie Frazier - DC for Minnesota Russ Grimm (my choice) - Asst HC/OL coach in Arizona Ron Rivera - DC in San Diego Darell Bevell - OC in Minnesota Brian Schottenheimer - OC in NYJ Kyle Shannahan - OC in Houston I know a lot of people want an "experienced" guy, but look around the league. A lot of the top teams are coached by guys in their first HC job. If Lerner hires a REAL GM, I would bet that the new HC would be one of the guys off that list. ------------------------------ Tim Couch is the ONLY Browns quarterback to beat the Steelers since 1999. |
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Realistically... because of the fans and tradition, and despite the owner, I think Cleveland is the most attractive team on that list. ________________________ Retain Mangini! |
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- Only if Jeff Fisher resigns.. These teams will not need a coach! If Em is fired- my ideal situation would be bring in Marty as Big cheese and his son as HC and keep Rob Ryan here! Forget hope! Show me some HEART! |
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No, because lerner has already stated mangini will be here next year |
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Soup, very interesting post on Cowhers ability to judge talent.
There are certainly qualified GM candidates that would come here and work with mangini, people who are good judges of talent. Why would he come here? Because an NFL GM job is one of the best jobs available in sports. If Al Davis can find people to coach for him then we can certainly find a qualified GM. It might be someone that hasn't been a gm before but has the qualifications, such as the guy with NY Giants ____ Yoda: NO! Try Not, Do Or Do Not, There is no try!!! |
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Considering how bad the Raiders are, I don't think I would use them as an example of a team that attracts quality people. |
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The Schotty family as an FO sounds kool.. but it'll never happen. |
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Absolute Requirments.
1. Must have atleast 1 SB win (2 perferred) 2. Proven track record of team building in the NFL. (From the ashes of hell peferred.) 3. Must be willing to sacrifice life for the team. 4. Must have a top quality and proven track record of NFL drafting and scouting. 5. Will be giving total control of football operations, with hiring and firing control of all staff. Only exceptions to to these requirments will be given to SB winning players like, Steve Young, & Mike Singletary  Steve Young..... would be my first choice. Shanny.......... would be my second choice. Cowher...........Mmmmm not sure -------------- Dawg Gone (I Miss using the term ManKok) |
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Where does Lerner say this? News to me. Even if he did, shouldn't you endorse your hired coach while he is here? What message would it send the players if Lerner says there will be a new coach next year? Their third coach in as many years. ________________________ Retain Mangini! |
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Here ya go, the terrible truth  look for the part about kosar i think that is were it is.Cleveland Browns owner Randy Lerner says Kokinis firing forced by unforeseen events, reaffirms support for coach Eric Mangini By Tony Grossi BEREA, Ohio -- Except for a brief chat with reporters following the 30-6 loss in Chicago on Sunday, Browns owner Randy Lerner has stayed out of the media glare while his team has slumped to 1-7. In his first extended interview since the firing of General Manager George Kokinis, Lerner agreed to answer a list of questions via email. Lerner would not comment on the reasons for the Kokinis firing, but he indicated the need for a "strong, credible leader" is a result of Kokinis' failings as GM. Lerner also said "no" to a question about whether he envisioned changing coaches. Because of the nature of the interview to which Lerner agreed, follow-up questions were not able to be asked. Question: The Kokinis firing indicates the Browns are in another state of transition. How do you justify changes being made in-season after only eight games after a complete overhaul in January? Lerner: My justification for the recent change is that circumstances dictated the action taken and I can assure you they were unforeseen. Q: Looking back at it, were there any signs early on that this season could spin out of control like it has? Lerner: It seems to me that the 4-12 record in 2008 and the fact that we won 24 of 64 games (37.5 percent) over the previous four seasons, combined with our record in the draft and free agency, were the early signs that it would be very challenging season for our new staff. Q: There have been reports that the Browns regard the termination of Kokinis as "just cause." Could you elaborate on the reasons for his departure? Lerner: We are not at liberty to discuss the details of George's departure at this time. # lernermanginito.JPGThomas Ondrey/The Plain DealerRandy Lerner made it clear in Wednesday's Q&A that he still believes in head coach Eric Mangini. Mangini will help pick next general manager: Browns Insider # Video: Mary Kay Cabot and Tony Grossi talk about possible future changes with Browns # Barton considering neck surgery # CBS Sports columnist says it's time for Mangini to go # Browns have all the makings for good reality TV show: Bud Shaw's Sports Spin # More Browns coverage Q: Is the departure of Kokinis a reflection of Eric Mangini's judgment? Lerner: No. It would be unfair to point to Eric in explaining George's departure. Q: One of the criticisms of your last coaching search was that you seemed in haste to hire Mangini at a time no other team was interviewing him. Do you regret not waiting and thinking it over longer? Lerner: No, I do not regret the timing of Eric's hire. My priorities in last year's search for head coach were previous coaching experience and a comprehensive plan. I felt that he met those requirements and is also at an age and phase of his career to continue to evolve his style and approach. Q: Jamal Lewis talked after the Bears game of retiring and appeared like the wind's been sucked out of him by events over the first half of the season. Does it concern you that a player of Lewis' stature would be so frustrated and drained at halfway through the season? Lerner: I've spent time with Jamal and have gotten to know him. He's frustrated because of how competitive and driven he is. I do believe that he believes in his teammates and the organization and will continue to play hard for the Browns. Question: Another criticism of your last coaching/GM search was that you hired the coach before hiring the general manager and that would leave the GM beholden to the coach. Do you regret doing that? Lerner: I don't believe the GM was in anyway beholden to the head coach. They had distinct and clearly articulated duties and responsibilities. Q: You spoke after the game in Chicago of the urgent priority to have a "strong, credible leader" to oversee the football operations. You had the opportunity to appoint someone in that position in January but you chose not to. Why? Lerner: I take issue with the word urgent because it could imply that a decision is imminent or could be made hastily. I recall saying it was the "highest priority" and by that I meant that we must have a visible, proven leader on the football side. In regards to why I didn't hire that person in January, the answer is that I expected the GM to evolve into that role. Q: If you bring in a new leader, what is the future of President Mike Keenan? Lerner: Mike Keenan does not oversee football operations. He manages the business side and league affairs. Q: The addition of Bernie Kosar as a consultant. What is his role and what will it be moving forward? Lerner: Based on Bernie's background in football as well as his friendship and familiarity with people in our building, we asked him to come in and get acquainted with more people and some of the approaches we are taking. As a result, he's been helpful in a number of areas. We have not discussed specific future roles with him, however. Q: The appearance of Kosar's addition is that he will imbed into things now to make a judgment on Mangini and report back to you. Do you see a scenario where Mangini would not be back in 2010? Lerner: No. Q: Dawn Aponte (vice president of football administration) has a low public profile but a much higher one internally. What is her role moving forward? Lerner: Dawn is a very talented executive and a good person. My hope is that her role and impact will grow within our organization. Q: Mangini brought in 10 players who played for him with the N.Y. Jets. None of them has been voted to a Pro Bowl. How do you feel about adding so many of his former players? Lerner: I don't involve myself with personnel decisions. Q: Kellen Winslow was traded in March and Braylon Edwards was traded in October. With all their warts, they were two offensive players who produced sporadic excitement on the field. These moves enhanced Mangini's reputation of not favoring "star" players. How do you feel about the makeup of your team? quinntb.JPGTracy Boulian/The Plain DealerWhile Randy Lerner did not publicly criticize the benching of QB Brady Quinn, he stated the decision had nothing to do with Quinn's contract. Lerner: The makeup of our team is built on the core values laid-out by the head coach in January. I think that the type of players we have on the team are increasingly reflective of those core values. Q: Brady Quinn was benched after 2 1/2 games. Do you think he was given a fair shot? Lerner: Again, I do not get involved with personnel decisions or player evaluations. Q: The appearance is that Quinn was benched so as not to achieve $11 million in contract incentives based on 70 percent playing time. How much has his contract contributed to his benching? Lerner: None at all. Q: Quinn has six starts in three years and now appears to be out of the picture. How do you justify that play time after trading two high draft picks for him? Lerner: Decisions as they pertain to playing time are made by the head coach. Q: Did Phil Savage's critical comments last week violate his contract and do you intend to pursue sanctions against him as a result of them? Lerner: On whether Savage violated his contract or not, I have no comment. I do believe that by having voluntarily weighed in on our current situation, he has invited a hard look at the decisions he made during his four years with the Browns. Q: Last season ended with six straight losses amid three quarterback injuries. Until that happened the team was 4-6 -- a disappointment, but not a disaster. In retrospect, should last year have been written off just as a bad season without blowing up the organization? Do you ever think you could have stayed status quo one more year? Lerner: I do not regret the decision that we made at the end of last season and felt the timing was right for a change. There were several factors that led to that decision, including on-field performance and the lack of an overall plan or philosophy. Q: It's possible that one or more of the Browns remaining home games will be blacked out on local TV because of not selling out. Do you feel that's a sign of the bad economic times or a sign of your fan base's lack of confidence in what's going on? Are you concerned that more local blackouts may happen next season as a result of a bad record in 2009? Lerner: I believe the risk of a blackout is driven far less by economic conditions and more therefore by the intense frustration of not winning for now five of the last six seasons. Q: When you visited with Bill Cowher last year, he said he wasn't ready to return to coaching in 2009 but asked, half-jokingly, "can you wait a year?" Would you revisit the possibility of Cowher coaching the Browns? Lerner: We have a head coach. Q: You indicated last year that you wouldn't own the team forever if you thought you weren't going to be able to turn it around. As long as the team's record continues to be what it is, you're going to be questioned about the possibility of selling. Is selling a possibility after a season like this? Lerner: No. |
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So in other words, Mangini is the "President" and we will be hiring another yes man GM to front for Mangini. He'll be making all the decisions including running the draft. Cool, Mr. Lerner. That's all I needed to know.
Might as well delete this thread. No quality GM will front for Mangini and serve as a yes man. Just man up Mr. Lerner and tell it like it REALLY is. Mangini is GM and Head Coach all rolled into one. -------------------------------------- Abandon hope, all ye who enter here. |
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Pretty much agree with you. He was sent packing in NY for very much the same reasons. This was merely the first shot fired. It's all coming down again due to the fact that the ship isn't being righted at all. Randy Lerner was expecting miracles, as many fans were, but the reality is that this is a serious rebuilding project that is going to take more muster than bluster or shrugs of shoulders. EM needed to get back to the basics of coaching a defense again and two organizations have made a mistake going with him. Give the Bengals credit for staying with Marvin Lewis. He came in with an 8 and 8 of course. This will not happen here unless something completely amazing takes place after the bye. There most likely will be changes this off season. RL needs a strong GM to get it all going. There's no turning back. |
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Unfortunately it seems you ay be right. i am usually not for firing a coach after one season but i think mangini just may have to go, and i really hate to say that to....i really do. But i dont think any qualified GM will come here with mangini already the coach. |
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Pete Carroll - GM
--------------------------- 5 Mill July 4, 2012 |
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Mike Holmgren or team Schottenheimer would be just fine.
Please be thinking these directions Mr. Lerner. Please...(asking nicely). Meanwhile, life goes on - Ob-La-Di. Ob-La-Da. |
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What about the GM that used to GM the Titans.
I think his name is Floyd and if I'm not mistaken weren't we looking at him just last year. |
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Eric Mangini has to be the coach. Right now he is very much more acting liking a GM. Something is very wrong with the picture. A quality GM would have him acting as, and being the coach. Someone like Bill Parcells, for example (only an example), or Mike Holmgren would have him dancing their tune and try to put an end to the embarrassment the organization is going through now. In other words, they would be teaching him how to be a head coach and hopefully let him coach correctly, if this is at all possible. He's been too aloof, in a way far worse than his mentor, whom he threw under a bus, Bill Belichick. |
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At least when he pays people to play for him in the NFL it will be legal! |
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This Lerner guy is an A-Class bum! Perhaps the most depressing interview ever.
Show Me Something!! |
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LOl - good one. You will never get Pete Carroll away from where he is. He is commited there - for good. |
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Floyd Reese. |
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Holmgren was "asked" to relinguish his GM duties by the Seahawks two years before his retirement (I think 2 years?). HC and GM are both very much full time jobs and very few modern day coaches have been able to pull off doing both well simultaneously. It's especially hard for a HC to build up a player's confidence and be encouraging about his performance and then turn around and negotiate a contract with him. That usually doesn't turn out well. |
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Exactly. Many men have tried to wear both hats and few if any have been successful. That's why were so lucky to have found Mr. Mangini, as he's more capable than the rest and will accomplish what the others have failed to do. Run the front office while simultaneously coaching the team.  -------------------------------------- Abandon hope, all ye who enter here. |
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Same ol GroundHog Day in football hell. Lerner has Learned nothing. Kokinis is scapegoated, Mangini will influence the next GM. The madness continues. Who cares about naming top GM candidates, NONE will come here because any of them are a huge risk to lerner spending the money to hire a top man and mangini losing control or even kkeping his job. Mangini/ Lerner are BOTH in CYA( cover your ass) mode.
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I think Dick Vermeil would make a good GM in charge of football operations.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. |
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Front Office/Coaching Staff
There's a lot of name-dropping in this thread. Cowher, Chuckie, Ozzie, Kosar, and so forth. The odds of all the stars aligning and the Browns getting some sort of Dream Team are slim to none. The price tag would be huge, as well as the ego clash. Kosar has just taken an advisory position, and I don't see him taking anything beyond that. I don't care who comes here, or who goes. I'll take a coach w/ no name over a Bill Cowher any day, so long as he knows how to win and surround himself with winners. What this team has lacked since 1999 is a sense of cohesion and making things happen. The FO has to be a team as well, and that simply hasn't happened yet. It's like everyone is on their own separate page. Players Honestly, I think the Browns have a severe lack of talent right now, especially @ skill positions. The OL is finally decent for the 1st time in a decade, and by decent, I mean still below the NFL average. Joe Thomas is easily our best player, and while that's good...it's a little sad at the same time. We are in dire need of weapons on both sides of the field. OFFENSE Anderson needs to go, period. Give Quinn his shot for the rest of the season and evaluate before the draft to see if we need a starting QB. Whoever rises up from the ashes, there has to be a commitment to stick with the guy. The Great Cleveland QB Debate has gone on for far too long. Hello? Josh Cribbs? Can someone put him in the rotation as a WR please? Jamal Lewis is hanging it up. We're in the AFC North, so the RB situation needs to be either Priority 1 or 2 in the upcoming draft. With a shaky QB situation, this team needs a solid runner with big shoulders who can carry this team. Pony up the cash for a FA or get one in the draft. Ideally both. DEFENSE The DL is starting to get into shape...finally. I like Ryan as a coach, so get some players for him to work with. The 3-4 requires stud linebackers, one at a bare minimum, two is more like it. We have zero. The Browns' secondary has been lousy for several years now. With so many holes in our roster, it's hard to address everything, even over 3 or 4 seasons. In my opinion, the defensive secondary is the weakest spot on this team, and needs addressed ASAP. Gameplan It's obvious (to me at least) that this team simply can't put points on the board. Offense wins games, but defense wins championships. If we can't score, then we should shore up the defense to at least give the team time to rebuild. As I see it, Rob Ryan is our greatest coaching asset at this time. Give him the tools he needs and build the team around a strong D. Recruit a power runner and pound it out on the ground, taking advantage of our second greatest asset: special teams. With Josh Cribbs providing excellent starting field position w/ his returns, a solid ground game and a strong D should be enough to position the team to win some games next year.  |
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No offense, but, I could care less what the draft boards are listing at this time of year. I'm guilty at looking at the draft boards as well, but, they are only useful at getting a general idea of how they rate the top 30 players. Taylor Mays is a football player, and the kind of player I want to see in our backfield. -- The only way to go, Draft Taylor Mays in '10! |
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bill parcells could opt out of his contract after this year and he is the only one who could turn this train wreck around
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Junior responds to questions via email w/no follow-up questions being allowed.
 No one else finds that odd? There is something wrong w/this guy. Seriously. |
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